Month: 11 Tishri 5784 (September 2023)

I hope you find something that will work and will taste good.

@JustinMac84 @FreakyFwoof @MoonCat So I've read this entire thread and honestly Justin's comments re: what counts as ableism remind me a whole lot of the shit defenses I've heard over the last almost decade regarding Trump's or Elon's or Kanye's antisemitism. At what point does lack of awareness stop being a get out of jail free card for this stuff?

@jscholes @FreakyFwoof @MoonCat I'm saying that we can and often do discriminate and/or show/hold prejudices against people and lack of awareness doesn't change that. It might mitigate it, and assuming that lack of awareness being pointed out by someone telling you that thing you did/said was ableist or whatever results in your deciding to change the situation by making yourself aware, then lack of awareness isn't+

@jscholes @FreakyFwoof @MoonCat an issue. But lack of awareness shouldn't be thrown out as some sort of "well they weren't aware so they can't be ableist" or pick something. Because too often people just go "Oh he's not aware" like that's supposed to make it all OK and frankly it doesn't.

@jscholes @FreakyFwoof @MoonCat Allowances can be made, up to a point, for ableism/whatever when it's genuinely based on ignorance. But only up to a point, and I'm submitting we're long past that point. The problem with tying any of it to intent is that if you point out that "hey that thing you said/did is ableist," (I.E., specifically harms people with disabilities in some way), all someone has to say is +

@jscholes @FreakyFwoof @MoonCat "Oh I didn't mean too" and poof, problem doesn't exist it's on the PWD or whoever to just deal. And I'm saying no we're done dealing because people have tried being polite about this stuff and it did 0 good so yeah claiming ignorance and expecting to be cut slack based on that is expecting PWD/whoever to have infinite patience and that's just not happening.

@jscholes @FreakyFwoof @MoonCat Shorter version: Asking PWD/whoever to accommodate ignorance, especially when it's doubtful that ignorance is what's solely driving all this, puts all of us in the position of having to solve problems that we didn't create. It also puts the responsibility on us to educate people who in a lot of cases are doing their best to remain uneducated. And it's just not our job to +

@jscholes @FreakyFwoof @MoonCat educate everybody all the time.

@jscholes @FreakyFwoof @MoonCat It's not ableist to be baffled. It's absolutely ableist to cross-examine someone who's asking for a specific accommodation, as this agent seems to be doing. That's not ignorance anymore, it's ableism and it's leveraging their curiosity in order to make someone's life just a bit more difficult.